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  1. #1
    Untanglit
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    Mar 2008
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    20

    Default Untangle being removed for the following reasons:

    We are removing UT because it is always beta, with issues:

    You get 5.2 working well.
    BAM! 5.3 comes out and issues that overworked IT staff dont have the time to ass about with:
    e.g: Cant Email VPN clients to anyone because Emailing directly does not work and using our service provider is not an option because SMTP authentification is not an option. Hell it does not even seem to be on the to-do list!
    Then 5.4 and VPN goes to hell in a handbasket! This is NOT ON in a business with over 700 workstations spread over 4 branches with overworked IT staff.

    I know that automatic upgrades can be switched off, but do Blacklists and AV updates stiil come through if one does this?
    It may say somewhere but it does not in the GUI; Ill never know because Ill be too busy working my ass off and then Ill die! (probably of stress)

    I read somewhere that we (the company) could pay UT to nanny their creation for us but doubt that they (UT) will be able to convince the tight fisted bosses to go for this. If you think you can you better bloody well say so now! (Ill keep the page open and refreshed)

    Fact of the matter is IPCop does not have hundreds of niggley little (if taking down a WAN is little) teething problems every time an update comes out and I suggest UT follow their example if they wish to get into the market for larger, critical, networks.

  2. #2
    mdh
    mdh is offline
    Untangle Ninja mdh's Avatar
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    Aug 2007
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    Default

    Well, emailing directly works fine. If it doesn't for you, that means that your email server is not setup to relay email from Untangle. There are reports that the 5.4 upgrade caused some issues with VPN, but turning VPN off once and then on once solves that. Automatic upgrades can definitely be switched off, and updates will still come through just fine.

    Emailing VPN clients will be a thing of the past when 6.0 comes out. I have no idea what "nanny their creation" means.

  3. #3
    Master Untangler
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
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    970

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Elliven View Post
    We are removing UT because it is always beta, with issues:

    You get 5.2 working well.
    BAM! 5.3 comes out and issues that overworked IT staff dont have the time to ass about with:
    e.g: Cant Email VPN clients to anyone because Emailing directly does not work and using our service provider is not an option because SMTP authentification is not an option. Hell it does not even seem to be on the to-do list!
    Then 5.4 and VPN goes to hell in a handbasket! This is NOT ON in a business with over 700 workstations spread over 4 branches with overworked IT staff.

    I know that automatic upgrades can be switched off, but do Blacklists and AV updates stiil come through if one does this?
    It may say somewhere but it does not in the GUI; Ill never know because Ill be too busy working my ass off and then Ill die! (probably of stress)

    I read somewhere that we (the company) could pay UT to nanny their creation for us but doubt that they (UT) will be able to convince the tight fisted bosses to go for this. If you think you can you better bloody well say so now! (Ill keep the page open and refreshed)

    Fact of the matter is IPCop does not have hundreds of niggley little (if taking down a WAN is little) teething problems every time an update comes out and I suggest UT follow their example if they wish to get into the market for larger, critical, networks.
    I do feel really bad for you. Too many companies overwork their IT people.

    If you have 700 machines and are overworked then you are probably making a huge over site. Companies of that size range don't run on the latest and greatest. You should be running on the last known stable build and have a test lab where you can beat up the newest versions until satisfied. You would inlist "special" users who would be willing to be on the test team so that you can test critical features like VPN and such before pushing out to the whole company. This wouldn't be just for Untangle boxes either, this would be for Server 2008, Exchange 2007, Office 2007.... basically everything.

    If you are in the California bay area shoot me a PM. I would be happy to help.

  4. #4
    Untangle Ninja sky-knight's Avatar
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    Apr 2008
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    Phoenix, AZ
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    26,241

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Elliven View Post
    Fact of the matter is IPCop does not have hundreds of niggley little (if taking down a WAN is little) teething problems every time an update comes out and I suggest UT follow their example if they wish to get into the market for larger, critical, networks.
    This isn't a fair assertion. IPCop is its own routing distribution with customized kernel and bolted on features that are largely built by a single development team. Untangle, is an amalgam of multiple open source projects each maintained by their respective development teams. To expect such a conglomeration to be problem free is a bit unfair. And, to not expect to have to reboot the thing every so often is also not fair. Do you or do you not reboot your windows servers?

    But, then again your basis for stability is IPCop which already speaks volumes. I think you're just frustrated because you are being overwhelmed on the time front. I feel your pain there, with the economy in the crunch everyone is downsizing which only serves to make the remainder pull double duty.

    I will echo your concern about the SMTP authentication feature built into the Untangle SMTP client. It does appear to be annoyingly incompatible.
    Rob Sandling, BS:SWE, MCP
    NexgenAppliances.com
    Phone: 866-794-8879 x201
    Email: support@nexgenappliances.com

  5. #5
    Untanglit
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    20

    Default

    Thx for the reply MDH:

    Emailing directly has not worked (for us) since version 5.2, if I remember correctly.

    Our Email is handled buy an external company via POP3 & SMTP.

    After reading the forums, turning VPN off/on was tried; to no avail.

    Thx for the info on Updates/Upgrades.

    Question: What protects the UT box from infection and manipulation?

    @ far182:
    Agreed about the LAB. The ..er... company... is based in South Africa, which explains the lack of anything as complicated as the concept of a LAB!

    @ sky-knight:
    I was not having a good day when I posted.


    That said I do not have the inclination or time to become a UT guru not to mention a linux guru.
    This, it seems, is what would be required, as re-booting the UT box has proved to be ineffectual for the said issues.

    I agree that one cannot expect UT to be as stable as an app written by 1 dev team.
    While paying for support may alleviate issues, I have a feeling that even then there would be unaccedptable downtime for a company of this size.
    The point is moot however as the chances of getting the bean counters here to pay for any firewall option are very small.

    This may be the reason that so many of the IT people here are immigrating!
    (I am looking at this option myself)

  6. #6
    Untangle Ninja proactivens's Avatar
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    Sep 2008
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    Greensburg, Pa
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    2,372

    Default

    Have you tried to reinstall from the ISO at all? Backup your config and do a reinstall and see if that helps with the problems. I have 1 installation that email isnt working. I have 3 others where email is working great. I may have messed it up while playing with bypass or packet filter rules. This is a great product, and for the most part, its "free". Bugs are to be expected, and the dev team seems to be pretty willing to address bugs.

  7. #7
    Untangle Ninja proactivens's Avatar
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    Default

    Oh, and in 6.0 emailing certs is a thing of the past..... Looks like I am going to be installing that beta sooner than I thought!

  8. #8
    Master Untangler
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    Default

    Any production system should have a support contract. The Untangle support is fantastic and they would be able to get to the bottom of the problem in no time.

  9. #9
    Untangle Junkie dmorris's Avatar
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    Nov 2006
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    San Carlos, CA
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    17,747

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Elliven View Post
    I know that automatic upgrades can be switched off, but do Blacklists and AV updates stiil come through if one does this?
    Yes, they do.
    Attention: Support and help on the Untangle Forums is provided by volunteers and community members like yourself.
    If you need Untangle support please call or email support@untangle.com

  10. #10
    Untangler
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
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    36

    Default

    If a company of this size is not willing to invest in IT security, then they do not understand the business risks involved. There is a wealth of information about how rapidly computer threats are increasing - just check the zdnet newsletters for help making your case...

    I'm not aware of a better comprehensive solution than Untangle, at any price, but, it is not perfect. It is a rapidly evolving product - which it must be to keep up....

    For this reason, we implement it as a pass-through, not a router, and use separate dedicated hardware for firewall/VPN.

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