Results 1 to 6 of 6
  1. #1
    Newbie
    Join Date
    May 2021
    Posts
    3

    Default Pings dropping continuously until change/save

    I have an Untangle 16.5.2 install on a Z4, that is experiencing packet loss of around 50% when measured via ICMP, and just general oddness. The site has a Spectrum Coax gigabit plan, and we've tried it with both static IP's (with a static ip, you have to connect through a provided Sagecom router that they put in bridge mode, so it's effectively a 2-device setup meaning Untangle-Sagecom Router-Spectrum Modem) and DHCP (direct from untangle to modem).

    When configured with a static IP, I setup a Zabbix server at a separate site and pinged the gateway, as well as the Untangle. Randomly, after a few hours/a day pings will start dropping 50% of the time to the untangle. Pings to the gateway work 100%. What is particularly bizarre, is that using the ping tool on the untangle, I can also replicate the 100% ping to gateway, 50% packet loss beyond the gateway. When working with Spectrum support on one of the many calls regarding this issue, they strangely said during one of the packet loss events that 'no client device (aka, untangle) was showing up in the ARP table on Spectrum's equipment.

    During a 50% packet loss event, if I change/save anything on the Untangle, as soon as the finishes saving, the issue resolves itself. If I reboot the modem, the issue resolves itself. If I reboot the untangle it resolves itself. It's the fact that simply changing anything in Untangle seems to fix it is what bothers me.

    I had spectrum change us to DHCP so I could eliminate the router, and connect directly to the modem, and the issue perists.

    I have replaced the network cable with another new cable. I have completely wiped the firewall and reloaded from USB from Untangle. When I wiped/installed, I manually reconfigured with a basic configuration, to ensure I didn't somehow screw something up, or corrupt something. Only Apps currently enabled are Reports and Firewall. Using only 2 ports, 1 for WAN, 1 for LAN to LAN switch. I've tried using a different port on the Z4 for WAN to eliminate a NIC issue on the Z4. LAN has basic untagged traffic and 2 additional VLANS.

    Any insight would be helpful. I've never seen anything quite like this in over 20 years of supporting small businesses. Only thing close to this experience was when an ISP somehow assigned us the same IP as another customer, but I've tried multiple static ip's within the 5 ip range, as well as a completely unrelated DHCP address. Z4 is less than 60 days old.

    I've tried to have Spectrum replace their equipment, but they rolled a truck out there, plugged in their equipment and said "tested good". Cannot use customer supplied modem. I know I can force the issue and get a new modem/router, but I wanted to run it past the forum here first in case anyone else has seen this.
    Last edited by silvermatt; 09-22-2022 at 04:00 PM. Reason: Edit last paragraph RE: Spectrum equipment replacement

  2. #2
    Untangle Ninja sky-knight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Phoenix, AZ
    Posts
    26,542

    Default

    Clicking save on anything in the networking tab resets networking. This will cause the NICs to bounce on the server briefly. This process will reset the NICs themselves, and anything attached to them.

    It sounds to me like either a bad cable between Untangle and the modem. But you swapped cables. So now we're in a more esoteric space of you have a z4 that's electrically incompatible with your spectrum equipment. Fortunately, there's an easy fix and test for this. Place an inexpensive unmanaged layer 2 switch between the two units.

    This situation is relatively rare, but it does happen. And it doesn't matter what devices you're working with. Sometimes two interfaces simply hate each other, and the only way forward is to separate them.
    Rob Sandling, BS:SWE, MCP
    NexgenAppliances.com
    Phone: 866-794-8879 x201
    Email: support@nexgenappliances.com

  3. #3
    Master Untangler
    Join Date
    Mar 2021
    Posts
    157

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by sky-knight View Post
    Clicking save on anything in the networking tab resets networking. This will cause the NICs to bounce on the server briefly. This process will reset the NICs themselves, and anything attached to them.

    It sounds to me like either a bad cable between Untangle and the modem. But you swapped cables. So now we're in a more esoteric space of you have a z4 that's electrically incompatible with your spectrum equipment. Fortunately, there's an easy fix and test for this. Place an inexpensive unmanaged layer 2 switch between the two units.

    This situation is relatively rare, but it does happen. And it doesn't matter what devices you're working with. Sometimes two interfaces simply hate each other, and the only way forward is to separate them.
    This is a quick and easy test/fix..

    Have been working with VerizonFIOS Business and NGFW for years without issue. Recently had 2 ONT's on separate fiber lines back to different Nodes constantly dropping connection.. FIOS informed me they have new/different manufacturer using different NICs in their ONT and to throw the unmanaged switch in there... both ONT fixed instantly. Zero dropped connections after that... they just didn't want to play nice together without the unmanaged switch between them

  4. #4
    That Which Lurks Below
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Posts
    134

    Default

    You'd think, with more than fifty years' experience with the concept of networking, we as a species could manage to iron out these incredibly basic 'play nice' issues!
    Græme Ravenscroft • Technical Marketing Engineer
    ('gram', like the unit of measurement)
    he/him
    Please don't reboot your NGFW.
    How can we make Arista ETM products better?

  5. #5
    Untangler
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    592

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by gravenscroft View Post
    You'd think, with more than fifty years' experience with the concept of networking, we as a species could manage to iron out these incredibly basic 'play nice' issues!
    A tool that might help is traceroute. Or even better MTR (My Trace Route). It provides real time info all along the route. It is available for most operating systems even openwrt and debian buster and bullseye. Works on 16.5.2 without adding any other packages. And it supports json. Might be a nice tool to add to the bullseye version.
    https://untanglengfirewall.featureup...erout-with-mtr

    Looks like links to feature requests no longer work. Just search for mtr.Or login and then click the link.
    Last edited by donhwyo; 09-23-2022 at 10:23 AM.

  6. #6
    Newbie
    Join Date
    May 2021
    Posts
    3

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by sky-knight View Post
    Clicking save on anything in the networking tab resets networking. This will cause the NICs to bounce on the server briefly. This process will reset the NICs themselves, and anything attached to them.

    It sounds to me like either a bad cable between Untangle and the modem. But you swapped cables. So now we're in a more esoteric space of you have a z4 that's electrically incompatible with your spectrum equipment. Fortunately, there's an easy fix and test for this. Place an inexpensive unmanaged layer 2 switch between the two units.

    This situation is relatively rare, but it does happen. And it doesn't matter what devices you're working with. Sometimes two interfaces simply hate each other, and the only way forward is to separate them.
    Thanks for posting, don't take my response as refusing assistance.

    If the issue was simply 2 NIC's not communiucating with each other, wouldn't the issue be resolved by bypassing the ISP's passthrough router, and plugging into their modem directly? I would assume if it was one of those "1 in 1000" incompatibility issues, it shouldn't persist between 2 different manufacturer's devices from the ISP?

    And to the other poster indicating they had the issue resolved by tossing in a switch, I appreciate the anecdote as well. I simply have had too many bad experiences with unmanaged small switches freezing sporatically, I just hate adding another layer of complexity to the network. I suppose as a temporary test I will go ahead and do so just to see if the issue goes away. I struggle with having that be a long term solution. Hopefully I can get the ISP to provide a different model modem that would avoid the issue entirely without adding another device in the middle.
    Last edited by silvermatt; 09-23-2022 at 09:57 AM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

SEO by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2