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  1. #61
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    Sep 2020
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    Hi,

    I’m not an Untangle user yet- what determines the license count towards the limit? Right now I have a LAN and a VLAN- using Ethernet and also AP broadcasting an SSID for each (LAN and VLAN). Separate /24 subnets for each.

    If I have 25 actual devices, some on Wi-Fi and some on Ethernet - maybe even some more on both ( I even have a hyper v VM with virtual switch on one device)- is the device limit based on MAC ID of the actual device? Or Mac of the connected GBE port?

    What if I use mostly IPV4, but devices also get IPV6 IP?

    Thanks! I can see perhaps how it’s easy to hit a limit. Yes I could bypass VLAN stuff, but I don’t want to.

  2. #62
    Untangle Ninja sky-knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SHV_30067 View Post
    Hi,

    I’m not an Untangle user yet- what determines the license count towards the limit? Right now I have a LAN and a VLAN- using Ethernet and also AP broadcasting an SSID for each (LAN and VLAN). Separate /24 subnets for each.

    If I have 25 actual devices, some on Wi-Fi and some on Ethernet - maybe even some more on both ( I even have a hyper v VM with virtual switch on one device)- is the device limit based on MAC ID of the actual device? Or Mac of the connected GBE port?

    What if I use mostly IPV4, but devices also get IPV6 IP?

    Thanks! I can see perhaps how it’s easy to hit a limit. Yes I could bypass VLAN stuff, but I don’t want to.
    The information is displayed on your Untangle dashboard, in the Network Information box. The number you want is Maximum Active, that's your license needed counter.

    There's some tomfoolery going on that Untangle has never really defined when Untangle has MAC address access to consolidate this count if a device changes IP address, but the short and easiest to understand answer is the Maximum Active counter is the number of IP addresses accessing anything through Untangle.

    When mixing protocols, this get a bit messy because any device that has v4 and v6 will present to the network as two separate devices, unless the MAC address is known to Untangle it has no way of knowing those two addresses are the same device. But at the moment this is largely academic because Untangle doesn't really do v6.
    Rob Sandling, BS:SWE, MCP
    NexgenAppliances.com
    Phone: 866-794-8879 x201
    Email: support@nexgenappliances.com

  3. #63
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    Sep 2020
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    Thanks. Keep in mind that I am not yet an Untangle user, so I don’t have the dashboard or UI.

    How would Untangle “know” the MAC ID and hence consolidate when IP addresses change? Does it register the MAC when a service first connects?

    Even with V6 unsupported yet, I note that at least one of my IoT devices (a thermostat) has an IPV6 IP in it’s connection settings. Not being familiar yet with V6, I don’t know if it is the equivalent of a V4 ‘169..’ default IP- but my under is that V6 IP are now always routable and private IP no longer exists?

    Also, while I turn it off, the new iOS private address scheme I assume can cause issues with device counts perhaps? Ditto if DHCP ‘remembers’ a device IP no longer in use but previously disconnected?

    Again apologies for not having the UI and dashboard- so I may not fully understand. But I would hate to buy HW + Home Basic license only to find that I need to spend more each year.

    Thanks!

  4. #64
    Untangler
    Join Date
    May 2017
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    52

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    Quote Originally Posted by Isitpluggedin View Post
    yes that's "little" they get out of it, market exposure, IT people trying at home, Our data casting a wider net on the internet?
    Maybe it's the internet, but I can't tell if you're being sarcastic, or if we have different definitions of the word "little".

  5. #65
    Untangle Ninja sky-knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SHV_30067 View Post
    Thanks. Keep in mind that I am not yet an Untangle user, so I don’t have the dashboard or UI.

    How would Untangle “know” the MAC ID and hence consolidate when IP addresses change? Does it register the MAC when a service first connects?

    Even with V6 unsupported yet, I note that at least one of my IoT devices (a thermostat) has an IPV6 IP in it’s connection settings. Not being familiar yet with V6, I don’t know if it is the equivalent of a V4 ‘169..’ default IP- but my under is that V6 IP are now always routable and private IP no longer exists?

    Also, while I turn it off, the new iOS private address scheme I assume can cause issues with device counts perhaps? Ditto if DHCP ‘remembers’ a device IP no longer in use but previously disconnected?

    Again apologies for not having the UI and dashboard- so I may not fully understand. But I would hate to buy HW + Home Basic license only to find that I need to spend more each year.

    Thanks!
    Probably should move this to a new thread, but I can try to answer some of that here.

    MAC addresses are network standard addresses that live on layer 2, it's how a network switch knows what port to put a frame on. If there is no other router on your network Untangle will have direct layer 2 access to all devices on that network, or on those networks. As such, the MAC address defines a device, because that's a unique hardware identifier. You will see these list in the "devices" tab in the Untangle UI.

    Now, any device with an IP address will also list in the "hosts" tab in your Untangle UI. That list is far more comprehensive because it will list out any IP address that's coming through the Untangle server.

    There's a period of time any given address when it goes through Untangle burns a license after that time it's freed. So we're not talking about devices as if you need to license every single device your network will ever see. You only need worry about the number of them online at any given point in time. Again, which is indicated by the Maximum Active number in the dashboard.

    If this is confusing by far the easiest way to know what your licensing needs to be, is to install the free Untangle platform, configure it as a router, and use it. You won't have content control, or any of the paid modules but you will have a ton of information you didn't have before. After it's run for a few days, that Maximum Active number will be accurate and you can base purchasing decisions off that.

    If you're planning on doing this in your home, the numbers are going to boil down to how you use your connectivity. I have 6 people in this house, everyone has their own desktop, everyone has their own mobile device, and most people have their own laptop. Toss in the VMs and everything else I use in my home office and I still only have 21 maximum active devices. Now the real count is a bit higher because I have IP Phones and certain streaming items that are bypassed. So my real count is probably 30ish.

    Home Protect is good for 50, Home Protect Plus is good for 150. I'm having a hard time envisioning a home environment wherein that many devices is required, UNLESS you're going IoT happy, and you've got an IP address for every light bulb. But again that's why I recommend Unifi networking gear, dedicated wireless networks for that stuff, so you can bypass it or manage it separately. In many ways our home networks are more insane and technically challenging than a business network!
    Bollar likes this.
    Rob Sandling, BS:SWE, MCP
    NexgenAppliances.com
    Phone: 866-794-8879 x201
    Email: support@nexgenappliances.com

  6. #66
    Master Untangler
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    Jun 2015
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    NW Arkansas
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    How does the legacy Home Complete differ from Home Protect Plus, aside from cost? Am just preparing myself for the inevitable. If there’s already a link to compare their licenses, it would be appreciated.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  7. #67
    Untangle Ninja sky-knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by miles267 View Post
    How does the legacy Home Complete differ from Home Protect Plus, aside from cost? Am just preparing myself for the inevitable. If there’s already a link to compare their licenses, it would be appreciated.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Legacy Home complete was originally all current paid modules, Home Protect Plus is that again... just in 2020 available modules instead of wherever Home was cut off... 2018?

    You also lose the unlimited device cap, and get it replaced with a 150 device cap.

    Will Home Protect Plus get any new modules that come down the pipe? I'd say not... given that the word "complete" is no longer in the name. But Untangle hasn't defined that.
    miles267 likes this.
    Rob Sandling, BS:SWE, MCP
    NexgenAppliances.com
    Phone: 866-794-8879 x201
    Email: support@nexgenappliances.com

  8. #68
    Master Untangler
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    Apr 2020
    Location
    United Kingdom
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    OK... First off, I don't think the price for Home Protect Plus is a bad price. Compared to what I had to spend on Sophos XG before I switched to Untangle, that's a steal.

    Having said that, it does seem that Untangle are saying "Jeez... We were giving you waaaay too much for your money with Home and could easily charge 3x that if we throw in WireGuard and Threat Prevention (which is what everyone is screaming at us for...)"

    I think what seems to be causing a lot of the rancour is that from $50 - $150 is a bit of a hike, but that's more down to Untangle having given so much for so little compared to the competition. But be careful Untangle... The closer you creep your prices to all the other offerings out there, the easier it is for people to jump ship if they don't like what you produce. At $50 a year, your software would have to be really bad for me to consider moving to some platform that I would have to pay $100+/yr for.

    Having said that... It's nice to know that if you don't want the extra apps you can keep renewing your current Home license. And for clarification, my Home License, About > License page says 50 seats, is that not a device limit then - everyone seems to be saying that the current home license doesn't have a device limit, or is that some earlier home version?
    Last edited by Armshouse; 11-20-2020 at 03:00 PM. Reason: typos

  9. #69
    Master Untangler
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    Dec 2018
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    190

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    Quote Originally Posted by csherman View Post
    @csherman

    I get then when I try to Upgrade my 5-year Home Pro license?

    "One or more of the selected products cannot be upgraded any further."
    wbennett77 likes this.

  10. #70
    Untangler
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Posts
    60

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    Been using Untangle for circa 6 months with a Home license, I'm reviewing pfsense, opensense, sophos xg etc again. At this time I'll just let the subscription lapse and will park it at that.

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